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Let's Talk Pet Foods
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Post subject: 2007-10-02 SALMONELLA & Feeding Raw - Are They Dangerous?  Posted: Tue Oct 02, 2007 4:47 am |
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Joined: Mon Sep 24, 2007 8:35 pm
Posts: 1033
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THERE ARE REASONS WHY SOME SAY RAW IS NOT GOOD OR EVEN DANGEROUS 2007-10-02 Written by Pamela MyersSomeone on a list read the recall on Bravo Raw Foods and Salmonella and said that this was one of the reasons her veterinarian told her over 5 years ago, that if she feeds RAW she takes a chance of nasties and salmonella.
viewforum.p ... a91f15f5dc (I must have moved the post) I will attach it when I find where I stashed it.)
Veterinarians in general, encourage and prefer and many times want, canned/kibble fed dogs........for a variety of reasons! Of course there are exceptions. The ones who do tout commercially prepared kibbles and cans, really have no valid reason for this, which makes any sense.... unless the pet is sick, perhaps. A couple of other possible reasons........
One reason might be.....they are selling SD or other Pet Foods in their offices. That would make sense! Another would be that it is a fact that until recently, proper nutritional training was not part of the required Veterinary College curriculum and I am not sure if that has changed yet....either, although it seems to be headed that way, from what I am hearing.
As far as feeding our pets RAW..... unless we are vegetarians, most of us prepare raw meat in our home every day/week. Chicken, especially, has a super high potential for salmonella ......and we are constantly warned about proper preparation... and clean up...... RAW meat is RAW meat........and no one ever says, let’s not feed meat to humans because it could transmit salmonella or some of the other bacteria if not handled properly......
The FDA has issues with *handling*......or so they say on their website. ~ and yet...... we *handle* raw meat in our kitchens all the time preparing our own family meals, which has the same potential for containing bacteria, and many times does......and we just not aware of it. (NOTE: The FDA allows 23% to pass inspection in our *human meats*, so they know this~!) http://www.fda.gov/cvm/Guidance/Guide122.htm
Whether we are feeding a high quality prepared raw meat, or just plain raw meat from the supermarket, to our fur babies there is no difference ~ the potential for Salmonella and other bacteria’s being present is just as high...and both types of RAW meat require the same special handling...
So much for using that for a reason! Oh, and let’s not forget raw clams, oysters, eggs in eggnogs, and those brave souls who eat meat raw as a delicacy! I don’t see the FDA becoming concerned about those things.
A very high percentage of ALL those who are involved in the Pet Food Industry, on many different levels, attempt to dissuade us from feeding raw because......... if Pet Owners continue the trend towards raw feeding, (and home cooking), the Cattle Farmers (downed cows) , Agriculture Dept (other downed animals), FDA (cost to dispose of), the sanitation dept (road kill), veterinary practices (our dead-medicated pets), laboratories (animals testing), etc, will have to find a new way to deal with the *disposal of all those 4D animals, as they will no longer be rendered for Pet Food! (It is used for other things, but not to the extent is used for Pet Foods)
It will also cost the PFI more to produce better foods without it.....or they, perhaps, will then add more *grains/fillers*, or ingredients and still will not meet our pets nutritional needs, only it will be worse. It will also cost the cattleman, a lot more money per head to have their downed cattle *removed*and perhaps incinerated.
As of around 2003, it was costing the cattle farmer approx $50.00 per head to have a downed cow picked up for rendering! The more people go towards home cooking, raw feeding etc, the more the Pet Food Industry, as a whole, will *continue* to lose ground........and the more they do, the more worried those who are benefiting from them financially, will become.
If they succeed in eventually passing a law which disallows rendered product in pet foods, the pick-up cost per head for disposal of downed cattle could shoot to $85.00 per head (probably more) ! And then, according to the FDA site and Garth Merricks inference, they would have no way to dispose of all that.
The FDA have tried already to do this and Garth Merrick and a sister company, KAREM FOODS, stood up against it along with the cattle association, of course!
viewtopic.php?t=137
viewtopic.php?t=136
They did this around the time of the BSE outbreak, when they stopped Canadian beef from entering this country. They were, or still are, having an issue with storing the tallow and parts of the bovine that are removed because of BSE! It was a huge issue~ I have yet to find the documents to tell me what they finally did with it. When the company that was *storing it all * took them to court , the court told them they had to remove it ! They did! I am almost afraid to see where it is now!
So, there is great value for those who gain financially from touting the wonderfulness of kibbles and and canned foods, and the dangers of raw and home cooking ...... many are in bed together at some level!
It is a known medical fact that dogs carry salmonella in their guts......... many times comes out in their stools.......... it has been proven and tested...... some dogs process it better and it appears to be assimilated, and others pass it out ...... If a dog is healthy, they rarely get sick. If they are ill, or have a weak immune system it *may* make them sick , if it is high enough in bacteria, otherwise it passes through their short intestines rather fast and does not have time to cause any issues.*
Veterinarians’ should certainly know this, (or admit they do) as well as knowing (and telling clients) that unless a dog is ill or otherwise may have a medically compromised system, it should not bother them! There are some that do know, and have no issue with stating their opinions, and I mentioned them and some of what they say, below.
LIL-LEA AND RAW
On the days I feed Lil-Lea her RAW, I do it in a clean, small bowl every time. I bought about 20 small *Pink* and *Mauve* cat dishes. (Shhhh, she does not know they are cats dishes~)
When she is finished, I then I scald the bowl with hot, hot water, in the center of my sink and it goes right down the drain and then I put it into the dishwasher. I can then clean the sink. (my sink stays clean lol)
If for any reason, I can’t clean the bowl right away, I *NEVER* put it in with any other thing in the sink. I put it on top of something on the backboard until I clear out the sink! I also pin up Lil-Lea’s ears just before I feed her. (see photo at bottom of post)
With any dry foods, I have a special container that is a tightly-sealed, stainless steel container with a neat handle, which I keep her opened small bag of food in, which I leave in the bag. The container is only used for that. I bought it at Wal-Mart for $12.00 *The Veterinary Merck Manual states some information on salmonella...... http://tinyurl.com/3cw258 They clearly state that unless there are certain conditions, ....it is a non issue ! When it does become an issue it has to do with certain circumstances. They should also know that KIBBLE has salmonella and so do many of the treats we feed our pets! With this latest recall I am more worried about what they are going to find next in the raw foods, then I am with the salmonella findings and...the FDA KNOWS that meats carry this and they *allow* a certain amount, so since they are recalling these treats...it makes me wonder how bad it really is compared to the average amount we see in our meats every day...... * MERCK MANUAL (Statement from above link about Salmonella)
Dogs and Cats:
Many dogs and cats are asymptomatic carriers of salmonellae. Clinical disease is uncommon, but when it is seen, it is often associated with hospitalization, another infection or debilitating condition in adults, or exposure to large numbers of the bacteria in puppies and kittens. __________________________________________________________ What Vets Say: Veterinarians and/or Other Pet Care Professionals Agree with and advocate RAW FEEDING and/or COOKING! Dr. Ian Billinghurst, B.V.Sc.(Hons), BSc.Agr., Dip.Ed. By defining something – or somebody- you are also limiting it. That is why I try not to be defined. However, if I am to be defined (and therefore limited) then I have to admit that by profession I am a Veterinary Surgeon. I am also a writer and a lecturer with my favorite topic being the nutrition of pet dogs and cats. My most important piece of writing is the book “Give Your Dog a Bone.” This book has changed the thinking of tens of thousands of people worldwide. More importantly, it has improved the health of these peoples dogs. Many of these people now look to me as the authority on feeding pets their evolutionary diet. Some say that “Give Your Dog a Bone” has become their “Bible.” more...................______________________________________________________ Dr. Richard Pitcairn, DVM I graduated from veterinary school in 1965, from the University of California at Davis, California. My idea was to be a practitioner and that is what I did for the first few years. Starting in a mixed practice (small animals, farm animals, horses, circus animals) I saw a wide variety of health problems and also learned much more about the conditions of veterinary practice. I did not see the results that I expected to have using the treatments learned in veterinary school and this, to me, was a disappointment. More............Resume'..............._____________________________________________________________________ Kymythy Schultze After recovering from a crippling illness through improved nutrition, Kymythy R. Schultze began a journey of intense study in species-appropriate nutrition and holistic modalities. Now, almost two decades later, as a Clinical Nutritionist and Animal Health Instructor, she's considered a trailblazer in the field of human, dog and cat nutrition, and her recommendations are endorsed by health professionals worldwide. More......................_________________________________________________________________________ Christina Chambreau, DVMChristina Chambreau, DVM, is an internationally known homeopathic veterinarian and lecturer. She was a veterinary technician from the age of 10 and became active in The Hunger Project in 1978. Graduating from the University of Georgia Veterinary College in 1980, she began using homeopathy in her veterinary practice in 1983, and has used primarily homeopathy since 1988.Dr. Chambreau is a founder of the Academy Of Veterinary Homeopathy and is on the faculty of the National Center for Homeopathy Summer School. As vice president of the Veterinary Advice Line, she provides a referral service so people can find the best care for their animal’s specific problem. More...............FIND A VETERINARIAN WHO DOES WHAT YOU WANT________________________________________________________________________ Tom Lonsdale, DVMDr Lonsdale appears to be a very problematic figure amongst his fellow Veterinarians. It seems he has caused or continues to cause great unrest among their peace and tranquility with feeding pets Kibbles. Just my kind of guy <VBG
Dr Tom Londale and the Australian Veterinary Association
It is fair to say that Tom Lonsdale is a controversial figure within veterinarian circles. He has regularly run in elections for the AVA, getting about 10 per cent of the vote fairly consistently. No-one can argue that he has majority support among veterinarians but a consistent vote of 10 per cent suggests significant minority support. His most controversial position stems from asserting the need for dogs and cats to be fed more than canned and dry pet foods: they need to be fed bones. The lengthiest exposition of his argument is in his book, published in 2001 and appropriately entitled Raw Meaty Bones. The preface to the book contains the following comments:
If you own a dog or a cat which you feed with processed food from the supermarket or corner store, you will probably find this book deeply disturbing …
The book is about what happens to dogs and cats if their diet is inadequate. These days most pet owners give their animals processed pet food. It may seem a convenient way of feeding but such a diet on its own is likely over time to cause the pets considerable ill health and suffering. And the signs of the ill health may not be obvious to many owners.More...........________________________________________________________________________ Dr. Wendell O. Belfield, DVMDr. Belfield does not advocate RAW Feeding and/Commercial Pet Foods, but advocates for Home cooking)
As a veterinary practitioner for thirty-seven years and a veterinary meat inspector for seven years, I, in good conscience, cannot recommend raw meat diets to my clients. My advice to my clients is "cook the meat until the redness is gone". When this is done, there is no vomiting, the cholesterol level is normal, the risk of infection by microorganisms and parasites diminishes.
It has been observed for the past decade or more that there has been a play on words by some pet food companies in their ads "no byproducts". Byproducts are classified into three basic groups: Inedible, human inedible, and edible.
INEDIBLE includes the following:
1. beaks of fowl, feathers, hooves of cattle/horses, hides, hair, and teeth
2. INEDIBLE (for humans) unprocessed stomach, unprocessed intestines, lungs, utters, bladders, uteri.
3. EDIBLE (referred to as Offal) liver, kidneys, heart, tongue, spleen, tripe, brains, lips, and thymus glands (sweet bread).More................_________________________________________________________________________ William Pollak, DMV What we’d like to speak on is the importance of freshness, wholesomeness, and the appropriateness of what is consumed.
The information we provide is for those people seeking powerful yet simple suggestions for enhancing Wellness in their companion animals, as well as their own lives. Not all seekers are looking for this enhanced Wellness. Most people in fact are satisfied with their dog or cat “looking” normal on the current commercial food; they assume the animal is just fine. It is not our wish to tell them otherwise. A developing sense of and desire for greater Wellness is growing in the world and is giving rise to this information. It is our hope that this small change, switching your pet to a natural raw meat diet, will enhance the quality of life of not just your pet, but your entire household. We have seen this time and time again.
Some concerns about Commercial Pet Food:More.......FANTASTIC EDUCATIONAL DOCUMENT DOWNLOADS HERE_________________________________________________________________________ Dr. Charles E. Loops, DVMThe health of your companions relies greatly on their diet. And like humans, animals prefer to eat foods they enjoy, they are easily bored with a repeated daily diet, and often need a variety of supplements depending on their state of health. The best diet is one approximating a natural diet in the wild. Dogs are mainly carnivores and cats are true carnivores, so a diet plan should keep this in mind.
Many guardians do not have the time or a lifestyle situation that would allow the time to home-prepare their companions' food. For these situations, I recommend buying a frozen, raw diet available from many sources. There may be a source in your area or you may have to locate one that sends frozen product via UPS or FedEx. You can feed some commercial dry food as part of a good diet. It is important that raw or fresh food be included at least three times per week to give your companions the opportunity for the best health possible. More..............__________________________________________________________________________ T.J. Dunn, DVM <SNIP>
Pet food manufacturers know very well how to make a great diet just like the one we put together. The problem is that it would be expensive to produce, especially if eggs and beef and fish were in it. And to be competitive with other pet food producers, the price of the food dictates what the foundation (primary ingredients) of the diet will be.
ENTER CORN... it's cheap, takes up lots of room in the bag of food and in the pet's stomach so it will "fill ‘em up", it's a good carbohydrate source so the pet will have some energy, it has a few amino acids in it so the corn will contribute to the protein totals on the guaranteed analysis list, and there's a cheap and steady supply of corn. So the pet food manufacturer makes a corn diet, adds some "meat and bone meal" (which has been cooked at least twice before it gets in the bag and may contain too much calcium) to "complete the amino acid profile" and adds a few other calculated substances so that COMPLETE AND BALANCED can be stamped prominently on the pet food label. <SNIP> More..............__________________________________________________________________________ Russell Swift, DVM Feeding Dogs and Cats Biologically Appropriate Raw Food…
It's only been in the last 60 years that dogs and cats have been eating processed pet foods and in that time, pet illnesses and problems have dangerously multiplied to include cancers, chronic renal (kidney) failure, arthritis, pancreatitis, diabetes, irritable bowel syndrome, colitis, allergies, obesity and behavioral issues to name a few.
Processed foods (even the most expensive brands and Rx labeled foods from your veterinarian) have had vital amino acids, vitamins, minerals, enzymes, and antioxidants devitalized and destroyed by heat, coloring, preservatives and other chemicals. These foods contain fillers, usually grains (wheat, corn, soy) and peanut husks, etc. that make up over 50% of the product. To make matter worse they list animal by-products as the source of meat.
A dog or cat on this kind of diet will develop waste-toxins in their blood, lymphs and tissue which weakens the immune system and makes them susceptible to More.............___________________________________________________________________________ From the British Journal of Small Animal Practice
Nick Thompson BSc.(Hons), BVM&S, VetMFHom, MRCVS Nick is a vet who is currently running his own complementary veterinary consultancy in Hampshire, having previously worked in a traditional practice for seven years.
I am committed to providing a personal, comprehensive, professional holistic veterinary referral service to the public and to veterinary colleagues for equines and small animals in homeopathy, acupuncture and nutritional medicine. Natural Feeding - Part 1
Any kind of cooking process will damage the nutritional content of food. This is made worse still if the ingredients that went into the food weren’t much good in the first place. Vitamins, proteins, and fats are all damaged during processing, and food can lose as much as 70% of its nutritional value before it gets to your pets bowl.
Feeding raw food gives your pet access to the full nutritional content of food. You need to feed smaller amounts and your pets digestive system has a lot less work to get the goodness out of the food. Raw feeding is new to most people, but it is quite straightforward as long as the balance of ingredients is right. For a range of recipes and information try one of the books about raw feeding. "Give your dog a bone" by Dr. Ian Billinghurst and "Home prepared dog and cat diets" by Donald R. Strombeck are both excellent. More.............____________________________________________________________________________ Dr. Donald Strombeck, Phd, DVM <SNIP>
B: How have you seen the pet food industry change during that time? What kinds of impacts has it had on the teaching of nutrition at vet schools?
DS: It has become a gigantic, multibillion dollar industry. The industry learned to advertise and describe their products as being the “best,” at least according to them. But they have tried to control the education of veterinarians on pet nutrition. They send a lot of literature and books to veterinarians who teach. One of the dogmas they have promoted, and that many veterinarians have bought into, is that you should only feed commercial pet foods because they are a balanced and provide everything an animal needs. And that you shouldn’t feed any human food or add any table scraps to it. So, if you go to most veterinarians, that is what they are going to tell you. <SNIP> Read entire article! It is another good one!
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